Airsoft Evaluation Course (AEC)

[Professor]

Hear ye, hear ye...

I have requested and received permission from the land owners of Rogue Manor in Manitowoc, i.e the TFD facility, to run an AEC.

The plan is to run the AEC on Sunday January 15th.

All players whom are between the ages 15 to 17 and any player of any age 18 and above whom are simply interested are recommended to attend. Many of you may have noticed that The Lair and Manitowoc requires it and there has been discussions regarding the War Game Room field also doing so. What this means is that all of the available fields understand the importance of attending the program especially in the interest of safety. It may soon be a necessity at all fields that you have attended this program, or it's accepted equivilant, if you are 17 or younger

ALL interested parties please post your intentions regarding attending this program please.

BTW, I'm 50 and I took it some 3 to 4 years ago...it's not only educational but fun too. Oh, and a skirmish has been known to break out afterwards. Oooh, and we will be in close proximity to the TFD CQB facility...hhhmmm I wonder?

[Professor]

One other note as to the AEC location...

We chose Manitowoc because it is the only field which can house the "classroom" portion of the course indoors. It is kinda cold ya know and will most likely be so in January too.

I know that for some of you WGR or the Lair would have been closer, but they can't provide an indoors area for the parts that don't involve shooting. The other locations will be used at the other two scheduled times in the year.

Directions to Rogue Manor will be posted soon -

[RTO]

Thank you Professor for getting anohter up and running. I know theres a lot of people who have been wanting this lately and I know I have two or three people who are in need of it.

[demonmutiny]

omg yes, ive been waiting for one of these!

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Wait, but if an AEC may be required to play at WGF, than wouldn't AECs need to be held A LOT more often so that new players/players that moved from other states would be able to play at fields other then Apoc, than? Because if the WGF AEC rule is implemented, than with the current scheduling of the AEC those people could have to wait 6+ months for another AEC to roll around so that they could be able to play anywhere other than Apoc (which has what, 1-2 games a year?)


Also, unless there just happened to be an Apoc game going on while they were in town, a required AEC at all other fields would basically kill the chance to play for players that are "just visiting".

[crimtonic]

well i know i'll come, if at all possible. also i think a friend o mine will also come.

[Professor]

We are planning to provide a regular schedule of 3 AECs a year spread about every 4 months and will attempt to accomodate any needs inbetween (On Demand type) as they occur. That is why I coordinated with The Lair, The War Game Room and Rogue Manor to provide their fields as AEC training locations. I am coordinating a date for each site and will publish a regular schedule soon.

Also, I am discussing with the membership various modifications and revisions to the existing curriculum. The primary intent of the program is to introduce new and old players to the sport and to ensure their playing it in as safe a manner as possible. The current course covers additional information and we are weighing whether to continue to offer that as part of the course or as an ancillary program.

So, yes, in the past they were not available often and that caused problems...now we are addressing that.

[Tucker]

Any cost associated in attending this course?

And yes indeed, mmm, CQB facility. :D

[Professor]

Nope, no cost at all except getting there and whatever you need to participate - i.e. BBs, etc.

[Dogboy]

Wait, but if an AEC may be required to play at WGF, than wouldn't AECs need to be held A LOT more often so that new players/players that moved from other states would be able to play at fields other then Apoc, than? Because if the WGF AEC rule is implemented, than with the current scheduling of the AEC those people could have to wait 6+ months for another AEC to roll around so that they could be able to play anywhere other than Apoc (which has what, 1-2 games a year?)


Also, unless there just happened to be an Apoc game going on while they were in town, a required AEC at all other fields would basically kill the chance to play for players that are "just visiting".

The AEC has only been required for those between the ages of 15 and 17. It is advised, but not necessary, for all new players. As Professor said, they will be put on so that new players can go through one. No one should have to wait for 6 months before attending one. If you know of someone that is thinking about getting into airsoft, that would need to go through an AEC, make sure they get to the next scheduled one. If someone is "just visiting", I don't know what to tell you. If they are over 18 it wouldn't be a problem. Under 18 they would probably be out of luck.

[garyb]

There will be a supplemental safety course held at the WGF before each game. It will last about 20 minutes. This will get you into the game. Then once the AEC is held you can attend the full course.

[Dogboy]

There will be a supplemental safety course held at the WGF before each game. It will last about 20 minutes. This will get you into the game. Then once the AEC is held you can attend the full course.

That's a great idea Gary. It will give people an opportunity they wouldn't have otherwise.

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

The AEC has only been required for those between the ages of 15 and 17. It is advised, but not necessary, for all new players. As Professor said, they will be put on so that new players can go through one. No one should have to wait for 6 months before attending one. If you know of someone that is thinking about getting into airsoft, that would need to go through an AEC, make sure they get to the next scheduled one. If someone is "just visiting", I don't know what to tell you. If they are over 18 it wouldn't be a problem. Under 18 they would probably be out of luck.



Oh wow, that 15-17 rule totally slipped my mind, sorry :s . Just another case of me mistaking my demographic for the majority, I guess.

[Dogboy]

Oh wow, that 15-17 rule totally slipped my mind, sorry :s . Just another case of me mistaking my demographic for the majority, I guess.

No need to apologize. Easy mistake to make. Like I said, it is very advisable for every new player. An AEC was the first thing I ever attended, and I was 35 at the time. Great way to meet people, and a great way for new players to find out what is expected on the field.

[sloppy joe]

i think ill be coming and maybe with 2 other guys.

[Timmay]

what the hell is a supplemental safety course anyways? im curious, and would want to know if its even close to an AEC or if it would just give kids a false sense of security since most new people have a deaf ear until playtime.

[BoBgOdS66]

If the WAA mandates AEC for <18 year old players, yet only offers the coarse 3-4 times a year, they would need to be able to give a temporary status to players under 18, otherwise people would have to wait months before they could even start to play in legitimate games. Perhaps the WAA could make some sort of simple online safety course that would go over an introduction to airsoft and safety, then give a simple online quiz. After this the person would sine up for an aec and have to attend, but in the interim be allowed to play. If they skipped the aec, or could not make it, then they would have to get in touch with a WAA rep and take the quiz again, or face waiting untill the next AEC. It would't be perfect, but it wouldn't shaft younger players. Those who would try to cheat the system by not attending and just taking the quiz would have to fool a real life person (the WAA rep) and face not being allowed into any games for 4 months. Just my Idea, as the WAA is supposed to encourage players to play airsoft and do it safely, this would be a nice middle ground. It would also take some of the burden off individual field owners like Gary. In the end, if the WAA takes the hardline and doesn't allow minors to play without AEC no matter what, then the economic incentive for field owners to abondaon the rule would come into play. However if the WAA gives an interim or probationary period, then field owners will still have the whole market to cater to, even while implementing the WAA standard.

[Raven218]

ehhh AEC dosnt sound to shabby... lemme see whats crackin around then and i'll see if i can get a ride up there... oo cqb, me m4 isnt cut out 4 it :)


-Jason

[Ameoba Grande]

Isn't the AEC basicly the same type of thing as hunters safety. I took that would that count?

[Nesbit]

Isn't the AEC basicly the same type of thing as hunters safety. I took that would that count?

They are not the same thing, and no hunter's saftey does not count as a suitable substitute for the AEC.

[RTO]

Isn't the AEC basicly the same type of thing as hunters safety. I took that would that count?


They are not the same thing, and no hunter's saftey does not count as a suitable substitute for the AEC.

From what I remember at my AEC, it was comparable to the whole hunters safety class, but we are dealing with "dummie weapons", ones that cannot shoot all to far so I do agree that it is still not the same. I had two of my guys that went with me say that it was pretty much the same as what they learned in hunters safety.

[Timmay]

Then people werent paying attention.

There is gun safety, but there are many other factors since you are shooting projectiles at other people wearing camo in the woods. Ill just name a few....

knowing range estimation
muzzle sweep
trigger control
field hazards
handling civilian walk ons
emergencies(medical/lost)
radio channels(team/OC etc)
handling law enforcement.

Since you arent hunting people, hunters safety similarity stops at gun safety.
In Airsoft you have to know many other things to be considered responsible.

[Dogboy]

Timmays right. The AEC is only similar to hunter's safety when considering the safety portion. There is more to it than that. People have a tendancy to think that airsoft guns can't really hurt someone, so they get careless. Just ask anyone that has been shot at less than 10'.

[demonmutiny]

Hmm, this would be my first aec, since im only 16 i would need this but yah, it teaches us the important stuff about airsoft which is safety first, and idk if they go over the rules with police since i havent been there but its a major subject everyone needs to know!

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Does anyone have a rough estimate of how long the classroom portion lasts?


(sorry if its already stated in this thread, but I don't think I saw it).

[Timmay]

At least half a day. Its relative also, to when people finish tests and such. You have to listen to pass. Its not just a seminar you listen to.

[Raven218]

crap i gotta listen :o .. Just kidding i'm a pay attention kind of guy. i retain knowladge so yea if i can get a ride up there i'll prolly be there.

[Bucket]

yeah you have to take a test at the end of it

[Professor]

This is what I have delineated from the postings thus far. If I have included or excluded you in error please let me know asap.

RTO – says 2 or 3 people who need it
Demonunity
Crimtonic and friend possibly
Tucker
SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Raven128 – maybe


If all of the above attend then we currently have 11 or so.

[Vanac]

maybe like 3 from us.

[Professor]

Thanks Vanac...count now somewhere around 12-15.


TIMMAY, please contact me...have sent PMs and email

[demonmutiny]

Prof, if its easier just put demon for short since you spelled the mutiny part wrong, just saying

[Professor]

Demon ....doh! big difference between mutiny and unity, eh?

[demonmutiny]

lol yah just a little

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

This is what I have delineated from the postings thus far. If I have included or excluded you in error please let me know asap.

RTO – says 2 or 3 people who need it
Demonunity
Crimtonic and friend possibly
Tucker
SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Raven128 – maybe


If all of the above attend then we currently have 11 or so.


I'll be there...

[Raven218]

its lookin pretty good for me. mom will only let me go if i can get 1 of me guys 2 go w\ and carpool (YAY!) so yea if that works out i'll prob b there. all i need is directions and i can finish this up, ask off for work ect...

[Scythe]

I'm probably going to come, one question though. So you take the course you pass and what not. What proof do you get that says you've taken it? Do you get a little card or something? That would be sweet...lol

[RTO]

Professor, The 2-3 guys that I know need to go are on their own for this one. I will be in California from the 5-11th of January and it would be rather selfish of me to ask work off for so much time and then ask off for a busy weekend day. So I will not be able to attend and the 2-3 that need it need to get together themselves to figure that out. Thank you once again though for the offer of the AEC and for getting it together.

[Lightning Fast 09]

i will try to be there too and i might have a friend that will come too.

[RTO]

I'm probably going to come, one question though. So you take the course you pass and what not. What proof do you get that says you've taken it? Do you get a little card or something? That would be sweet...lol

When I went I got a certificate that says you've accomplished all the goals of the course and someone said (i think) that the name is kept on a list for further WAA games so they know if you've taken it or not.

[Raven218]

will we be doin any small matches, because if we are i dont know if i should bring m4 due to it has a m120 in it..if we are i may leave it here and come w\ just my gbb's



-Jason

[Timmay]

Keep in mind it will be winter. GBB's might not even work.

Also-The course is designed with a STOCK AEG in mind. You can use whatever you have to, but remember, we cant wait an hour for you to figure out the trajectory of your springer pistol to the target.

Come to this class as if it was a game, but DO NOT gear up until we tell you its time. Dress for the weather also, its cold, and still snowy im sure.

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Keep in mind it will be winter. GBB's might not even work.

Also-The course is designed with a STOCK AEG in mind. You can use whatever you have to, but remember, we cant wait an hour for you to figure out the trajectory of your springer pistol to the target.

Come to this class as if it was a game, but DO NOT gear up until we tell you its time. Dress for the weather also, its cold, and still snowy im sure.


Ok for the classroom portion, do we need any school supplies (ie: pen, pencil, notebook for notes etc...)

or is it not that much like school?

[Timmay]

There will be tests, but pen and test will be provided to you. and unlike school, theres different versions of tests, so theres no universal study guide except for "listening" :)

[demonmutiny]

wow, sweet, i was thinking along with getting a certificate we should also get like a lamenated card or a patch, just incase they forgot or your name got taken for some reason??

[darksylence]

timmay ...

is my mp5 done yet? ... if ur at the AEC i could stop by and play some cqb and pick it up.

[Roadkill]

wow, sweet, i was thinking along with getting a certificate we should also get like a lamenated card or a patch, just incase they forgot or your name got taken for some reason??

Do you mean along the lines of taking the AEC and going to a skirmish and having the OC/ Owner say you didnt take the AEC?

[Maple]

After the successful completion of the AEC, a certificate is given. To get a patch and a laminated card, you'll have to shell out $35 and join the WAA. (You'll get other perks as well)

[demonmutiny]

oh, hmm ok i got it!

[Bucket]

After the successful completion of the AEC, a certificate is given. To get a patch and a laminated card, you'll have to shell out $35 and join the WAA. (You'll get other perks as well)

well you are supposed to get the patch and card. I asked Bob for a patch when i went down there to get my gun upgraded, but i am still waiting on the arival of my AWESOME laminated card

[Dogboy]

There will be tests, but pen and test will be provided to you. and unlike school, theres different versions of tests, so theres no universal study guide except for "listening" :)

I hope everyone is paying attention.;)

[-KGB-]

Now could somebody tell or give the directions as to how we as willing participent can get to the site of this aec. for those who never been to that field before.

[Timmay]

there no website for the AEC itself. That will change eventually, i believe theres something in the FAQ not to mention the wonderful incredible edible Search feature.

Far as where the next AEC is being held, UNconfirmed reports list Manitowoc TFD facility to host it. Updates for that will come from AEC personnel or the Woc boys themselves.

[Vigilante]

I think he means the site of the actual AEC, up in Manitowac there.

[Timmay]

I know what you think i think he thinks he means. but i know that you dont know he doesnt know what he knows.

I want him to clarify, AND the site needs to be in stone before anything is promised or wasted time being typed.

[The_Ska_King]

I really need the AEC so I will be there if it happens!!!!!!

[Professor]

Here is the list at this stage...please take a look and notify me of any corrections or additions -

RTO – says 2 or 3 people who need it
Demonmunity
Crimtonic and friend possibly
Tucker
SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Raven128 – maybe
Vanac – 3 from TFD
Gruzniak
Ravin128
Scythe
Lightning Fast and one other possible
Darksylence?
KGB
Ska King


Based on the above we may have as many as 20!

Timmay, can you post the address for the location in Manitowoc please?Thank you...oh, it's was confirmed

[darksylence]

I have already taken the aec. I would mainly be going for the gun, and cqb. I can sit back and listen to all the stuff again. So timmay, whats the situation on my gun?

[Professor]

Um, Dark...how about just PMing Timmay on your gun then, okay? I'll remove you from the attendance roster.

[Vigilante]

Also, professor, you put raven128 on there twice.

[Professor]

Thanks Vig

[Tucker]

sorry if there was misunderstanding Prof, I never actually said I was going before, and so far, I don't think I am.

[Professor]

Okay Tucker...you're deleted

[Roadkill]

Hey Professor I will be joining Gruzniak, so sign me up.

[Professor]

Gotcha RK!

[Raven218]

prof put me down as a maybe. I cant tell at the moment if I'll be able to go. If I go I'm bringin 1 guy w\ me cuz my mom refuses to take and pick up so we'd have to carpool... so put me down as a maybe and i'll try to get my 1 guy so yea.

[Professor]

Okay Raven...keep me informed

[Raven218]

will do i'll talk to him on uhh tuesday in school. hes up at his cabin this weekend so yea i should have an ide early next week.

[demonmutiny]

well, prof ive read the post between you and timmay and still havent spotted a link to the aec...just saying, maybe i missed it idk...if i didnt it would be nice to know before and not the day before the event cause if this is gonna be a long drive i need to tell my parents so they are prepared!

[Professor]

Demon, I hope to have an address and directions posted in a day or so.

[demonmutiny]

ok..thanks

[Professor]

Okay Everyone...here is the location information for the AEC

Yahoo Maps directions from Milwaukee:
http://maps.yahoo.com/dd_result;_ylt=AkEJaqrg9kxUuXtf3pu0L.sa3kcC?ed=vf_ TSeV.wimnU4nLnEc1NK1qeQ7SpalSgLOFZTUe_igEN4QUQLFae Vw8swt6.0InCabBdy3wt1.CC2dhftjaf3f4NxV8wg4u_OUy5Te MQl0OaA_uRqA-&name=&csz=milwaukee&desc=&tname=&tcsz=Manitowoc%2C+WI.+54220&tdesc=&mag=5&ds=n&om=6&country=us&tcountry=us&rkey=88_TTOR32XXCj9iGYXAj3fj.9N7WlaiaB4eQbAHRpbCeE FioRK.slIglKDrPQxdSDgwCJILYxVO6ZM9uNPCFPCs5lmZDyE3 GP0gwS4KR0C5ij7tiFEb.NTVt1o1F

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


The address is 2717 County Road Cr, Manitowoc, WI 54220-9213

I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

[The_Jackal]

I may just show up for this. Just to get some airsoft in during the winter. ;)

[Professor]

Uh, does that include attending the course?

[The_Jackal]

maybe? ;) ........Yea if I go..I'll be there for the course and I may bring my little brother.

[crimtonic]

ok well, update on me and my buddy going.

both my buddy and my dad will be comming too, confirmed.

[Night Stalker]

It is 2717 Cty Hwy CR NOT County Road CR. If you go County Road CR, you will end up going somewhere else.. TRUST ME!!!!!

[Black_Kade]

Pyrokid from EMR and I are going for sure, (I already attended an AEC) I have one more whose status is currently unknown. will get back to you on that.

Thx Prof.

[Professor]

Okay, my bad...I tried to get Yahoo maps to find the address and made a change that I thought worked. DO NOT USE THE LINK ABOVE Thanks for catching that NS!

The correct address is 2717 Cty Hwy CR Manitowoc, WI. 54220

Use the following directions...

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

[PePe]

what about coming from Green Bay Prof, or just give me directions to Action Cycle.

[crimtonic]

well, it seems my dad can't make it. but hey me and my buddy can, and i'll have my G18c by then. can't wait...

[Professor]

My suggestion would be to still get off the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit regardless of what direction you come from and follow the directions from there.

[Raven218]

ok prof its lookin good at the moment... made a negociation w\ dad, if he takes me and haagasus he can go gambling for the whole time we are gone, and its working so far. since its a cqb course any goggles requirements: ie full mask, ect...

also on the sidenote my m4 is kinda upgraded w\ a m120 so its not exactly cut out for fps limit for cqb... so yea... i'll give u a 100% go when i get it...



-Jason

[Maple]

The AEC is not neccesarily a CQB course. First, you are going to have the AEC, then, if people are willing to help set up (and tear down), we may have some time in the kill house.
And you are correct, 320fps is the CQB limit. Anybody who has a gun hotter than that, make sure to bring a sidearm.

[Raven218]

yea i was referring if we were to put the course up. and yea i'm gonna bring the usp...

[Maple]

The USP will be a lot better than any rifle you bring in. More manueverable.

[Kramer]

I'll try and make it, but i need an adress to find directions from my house.

[Professor]

Kramer - Your name has been added to the attendee list and from page 8 of this thread...

The correct address is 2717 Cty Hwy CR Manitowoc, WI. 54220

Use the following directions...

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

[Stelthturkey]

So we got, Mitch, Mike, Me, Kade, Kopfschuss, & PyroKid. Me and Kade have taken it already but were bringing them so... We can help out or just **** around for the whole day.

[Kramer]

Eh.. If you could please remove me from the list. I wont be able to make it, too long of a drive for the person who is transporting me (mom). Sorry guys. Maybe at the next AEC if its closer to Illinois or possibly at Paintball Blitz in Gurnee. Oh well, thats what i get for living a fair distance from 2 major cities, cant make it to games with the CAA or the WAA... Except for games at Gurnee, im close to there.

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Eh.. If you could please remove me from the list. I wont be able to make it, too long of a drive for the person who is transporting me (mom). Sorry guys. Maybe at the next AEC if its closer to Illinois or possibly at Paintball Blitz in Gurnee. Oh well, thats what i get for living a fair distance from 2 major cities, cant make it to games with the CAA or the WAA... Except for games at Gurnee, im close to there.


I don't think a WAA AEC would ever be at an Illinois field, sorry...

[Solo_Sniper]

I'll be sure to be there, along with two other people.

[Professor]

Okay Solo...got ya

Folks, here is the current list and a repost of the CORRECT address and directions -

AEC – Jan 15th roster


RTO – says 2 or 3 people who need it
Demonmunity
Crimtonic and friend possibly
SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Raven128 – maybe
Vanac – 3 from TFD
Gruzniak
Roadkill
Scythe
Lightning Fast and one other possible
KGB
Ska King
Kramer
Solo Sniper and two more


Directions:

The correct address is 2717 Cty Hwy CR Manitowoc, WI. 54220

Use the following directions...

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

[element365]

I plan on coming. It's a long drive but well worth it.

[Raven218]

as of right now i am 100% go, but i gotta make sure i got off for work (will find out later today) i am bringing 1 or 2 guys w\ me..

[Black_Kade]

Roster Update:

-Mike (crazy person I work with)
-Kopfschuss (EMR)
-Pyrokid (EMR)
-Mitch (This one dude I know from that one place)

Will all be attending the coarse and are the people RTO spoke of.

I will be there for scenery so every one can gaze upong my youthfully sexy body Ahem!! anyhoo.

There may be more than that But thats all i am sure of at this time.

[Raven218]

ok Prof we are 100% go. put me and haagasus and maybe 1 more guy.

[Professor]

Okay Raven...gotcha.


Just so everyone is aware...the activities afterwards if CQB will restrict aegs to 320fps. If your gun is hotter than that you had better bring something else such as a handgun and/or springer if you wish to participate.

[Raven218]

full seal goggles or paintball mask?

[Professor]

Full seal goggles for 15-17 years of age...a paint ball mask ain't a bad idea, but not required. However, wearing a balaclava isn't a bad idea either as an alternative.

[Vanac]

I would suggest wearing a lot of face gear. Shots to the face/head can be very common.

[Raven218]

yea i wear a rigged balaclava then my goggles but hey i'll bring the invision just in case.

[Maple]

Just as a warning, if you haven't been to the kill house before, expect to potentially get a little bloody. Face shots are common, and so is a little blood. Unless your face is already ugly (like mine), I'd suggest face protection.

[seppuku]

full seal goggles or paintball mask?For Indoor Close Quarters Battle games, I think the WAA rules (http://wiairsoft.com/documents/charter.pdf) call for a full-face mask for all players, but those over 18 can opt to wear a balaclava instead. I don't know if that rule is dated or even encforced at the TFD facility, but from what people are saying a paintball mask wouldn't be a bad idea.

[demonmutiny]

what about snowboarding goggles?

[Maple]

what about snowboarding goggles?
Are they ANSI Z78.1 rated? If not, than they do not meet requirement.

[Professor]

Seppuku is completely correct...sorry for my oversight. Thank you Seppuku for catching that!
FULL PAINTBALL FACEMASK for ages 15-17 Goggles, balaclava and other approved eyewear for 18 and above.


For Indoor Close Quarters Battle games, I think the WAA rules (http://wiairsoft.com/documents/charter.pdf) call for a full-face mask for all players, but those over 18 can opt to wear a balaclava instead. I don't know if that rule is dated or even encforced at the TFD facility, but from what people are saying a paintball mask wouldn't be a bad idea.

[demonmutiny]

well i guess i got to go a mask friday

[demonmutiny]

well if i buy it friday and (shell) out 20$ i will have it for all cqb games from now to then so doesnt matter

[Professor]

I have some of your call signs, but for the Certificate of completion I will need your "real" first, middle initial and last name. Please post that information ASAP as I will need time to print them up.

Thank You
Professor

[Professor]

I believe it is necessary to convey the following:

This event is solely created for the purpose of an Airsoft Evaluation Course (AEC). The regularly occurring skirmish that happens at the end is a secondary benefit.

If you are coming please do so for the purpose of attending course. If you are not coming to attend the course, but still coming please do NOT interrupt or interfere in any manner with the course. You may be asked to stay away from the participants. Creating any interference or interruptions may negate your ability to participate in any after event activities.

I am not trying to be harsh, but I want all to remember that this is an Airsoft Evaluation Course and not a regular skirmish.

Thank you

[Roadkill]

Randall T. Stanaway

Or you can just put Randy T. Stanaway

[crimtonic]

Andre' G. L. Korenak

[demonmutiny]

Michael A Kelly

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Andrew H. Zupkoff


edit: and just making sure, a PB mask is only for the skirmish afterwards, correct? It's not neccesary for the actual AEC portion, right?

[Beasthunter33]

God I hope I can come, if so my name is Nick J. Miller.

[Raven218]

Jason M. Cudnohoske

[haagasus]

Hey, count me in. Raven218, Punisher222 (Jack W. Kellner), and myself (Jake N. Haag) will all be there.

[Black_Kade]

Prof, could we get an updated roster? It seem as though alot has happend over the last 2 pages.

[Solo_Sniper]

James Weiss, Then my 2 friends name... Greg Hensen and Nick Klang

[crimtonic]

ah, and my friends name is:

John Weid

[Professor]

Black Kade -
This is what I have so far for attendance based on the real names I have received:
Roadkill - Randall T. Stanaway
Crimtonic - Andre' G. L. Korenak
Demonmunity - Michael A Kelly
Gruzniak - Andrew H. Zupkoff
Beasthunter - Nick J. Miller
Raven218 - Jason M. Cudnohoske
Haagasus - Jake N. Haag
Punisher222 - Jack W. Kellner
Solo Sniper - James Weiss
Unknown call signs - Greg Hensen, Nick Klang, John Weid


People I have not received real name info for yet:
RTO – says 2 or 3 people who need it
SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Vanac – 3 from TFD
Scythe
KGB
Ska King
Kramer

[PePe]

Prof i shall be one of thos people who RTO wont tell u my name

[Black_Kade]

Okay this is all i have for sure:

-Mike (dont know last name)
- Ryan Lapacz...Kopfschuss
-Jason heftke...Pyrokid
-Mitch Borzhack
-ME
-Bryon T. Pischke...Stelthturkey


Yay, these are the ppl RTO spoke of.

[Lightning Fast 09]

alright i will be there and my name is Jonathan R. Gulig. and my friend has drop out of this AEC but he may attend a later one. see you guys there.

[Vanac]

Vanac- Cody McCarey
Bucket- Alex Baeten
madhaTTer- Dick Flegel

[demonmutiny]

idk if someone said this before, but is the Class part of the AEC gonna be heated??, also i know if we do a cqb its gonna be inside, will that be heated also or should we bring warm cloths?? also if we do the cqb, will we be able to buy BB's, and so we bring snacks to eat or can we buy food?

[Maple]

idk if someone said this before, but is the Class part of the AEC gonna be heated??, also i know if we do a cqb its gonna be inside, will that be heated also or should we bring warm cloths?? also if we do the cqb, will we be able to buy BB's, and so we bring snacks to eat or can we buy food?
Bring warm clothes, but layer them. There is a good chance that the class room portion of the AEC will be indoor, as will the CQB if it happens. Bring your own BBs and food.

[Professor]

Thanks Maple. The classroom portion will be inside a garage, but won't be the warmest. As Maple said...layering is the best plan. No food or supplies will be provided/sold so bring all your own gear/goodies/food.

[Professor]

I still do not have "real name" info for certificates for the following attendees -

SloppyJoe and possibly 2 others
Scythe
KGB
Ska King
Kramer

[Bourne]

TFD Bourne: Dustin Burow

[sloppy joe]

sloppy joe- joe huber
ska king - ross dessart
Squirrel - brian klimogweski (not sure on spelling)

[Professor]

People I have not received real name info for yet:

Scythe
Kramer

[Solo_Sniper]

For the directions on how to get there. On mapquest there giving me 3 differnt things to choose from.Just wondering which one is the correct address.

http://www.mapquest.com/directions/main.adp?go=1&do=nw&rmm=1&un=m&cl=EN&ct=NA&rsres=1&1ffi=&1l=&1g=&1pl=&1v=&1n=&2ffi=&2l=&2g=&2pl=&2v=&2n=&1pn=&1a=1101+Beech+Street&1c=Sun+Prairie&1s=Wi&1z=53590&2pn=&2a=2717+Cty+Hwy+CR+&2c=Manitowoc&2s=Wi&2z=54220

[Beasthunter33]

I'm sorry for anyone I may have inconvinenced (sp?) but I did not realize how far away Manituoc is and it is just way too far for my mom to take my friends and me so I am gonna have to pull out of this one. Maybe one closer to the Milwaukee-Madison Area sometime in the near future then.

[Professor]

Beasthunter...sorry to hear it and understood...next time.

Repost for everyone who needs it -

The correct address is 2717 Cty Hwy CR Manitowoc, WI. 54220

Use the following directions...

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

Beasthunter...sorry to hear it and understood...next time.

Repost for everyone who needs it -

The correct address is 2717 Cty Hwy CR Manitowoc, WI. 54220

Use the following directions...

Go north on I43 towards Sheboygan/Green Bay.
Staying on I43, It will be 17.5 miles past the Hwy 23 exit in Sheboygan. You will past the Cleveland exit and then you will come to the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit. Get off on that exit. Take a right on hwy C and go about 200 ft. and you will come to another intersection and that is HWY CR. There will be a Mobile station on your left. Go left on HWY CR about 8 miles and you will go past "Action Cycle" on your right. It is the next driveway after Action Cycle on the corner of Hwy CR and Viebahn. If you get to Viebahn, you went too far. The property has 2 big yellow buildings on it. Park at the bottom by the buildings, not up by the garage by the house.


I will be carrying my cell phone in case anyone gets lost on the way - call me at 414-467-3459 that morning.

Be there at 9:30am to gear up and 10:00am to start. Plan that the course will run 3 to 4hrs and a skirmish may occur afterwards...this one may be in doors if everyone is prepared to help assemble the CQB facility walls.

Professor, me and solo sniper have both had the same problem, when you simply type in 2717 Cty Hwy CR, manitowoc, wi 54220, these three results come up...

1: 2717 Madson Rd
Manitowoc, WI 54220-9230, US

2: 2717 County Road Q
Manitowoc, WI 54220-9401, US

3: 2717 State Highway 310
Manitowoc, WI 54220-9659, US

[demonmutiny]

same prob prof, were from kenosha

[Professor]

Guyz...just take the St. Nazienz/HWY C exit off I43 north or south which ever way you are coming and follow the directions the rest of the way.

I checked again with NS and I belive if you put this address in maps.yahoo.com it will take you to the right place - 2717 County Road Cr, Manitowoc, WI 54220-9213

http://maps.yahoo.com/maps_result?addr=2717+County+Road+Cr&csz=Manitowoc%2C+WI+54220&country=us&new=1&name=&qty=

[haagasus]

Professor I am sorry but I have just been informed that I cannot attent the AEC Course. You may take my name off of the list and add in my place Nate Hense. Thanks.

[Dogboy]

Everyone planning on attending, follow the directions the Professor has posted. For whatever reason, mapquest isn't giving the correct directions.

Are we sure that Rogue Manor wasn't wiped out when those crazy canadians came ashore back in August?:D

[Black_Kade]

Okay, bad news, Mike and Mitch Borschzack (sp?) from our group wont be able to attend. The rest of us are still a go!

I however do have one more atendee for your list, Nathan Rudnick.

[crimtonic]

ok, two things:

- i'm stupid and i spelled my friends last name wrong; its actualy Wied

- i can't find a link to the waver, which i assume i'll need since my parrents nor my friends will be there. would you mind getting me a link?

thanks.

[Professor]

There is no waiver for this location.

[Professor]

I need the correct spelling for this person's name -

Squirrel - brian klimogweski (not sure on spelling)

[crimtonic]

oh there isn't? thanks for that. i coulda sworn i had seen a link floatin around. thanks a bunch.

[The_Ska_King]

I will be there. only brian knows how to spel his last name it's way insain

[The_Ska_King]

My name is ross Dessart and me and Brian K. are the two with Sloppy joe and his name is Joe Huber

[sloppy joe]

brian.k is no longer coming

[Raven218]

Thank you Prof, Tim, and Dog for putting on this course it really helped us alot. We wish we could have stayed for the CQB but o well.


-Jason

[Guerilla Dan]

Well next time, don't come. Plenty of us DID learn something from the experience, and you should be grateful that people gave their time, money, and land, to teach your ungrateful bum something.


Thanks for holding the AEC today guys.

[Fish]

Why delete your post if it is your real opinion? While we may all disagree with it, it may lead to some improvements.

[Stelthturkey]

I appreciated it, some of our guys needed it to play on gary's field now that aec is required...
I always hated cqb until today, and now im starting to like it, it was a good experiance and i got a decent amount of bangs.

Thx guys.

[NATHANIELJONESTHUGANGEL]

It was a great time, Tim, Prof, and Dogboy all did a great job of teaching us the basics of airsoft, and the CQB was a blast, even though I didn't get to stay for all of it, it was great to see some of you guys again, and I hope the trend continues once the weather warms up.

[Doc]

Great job of teaching each differnt part of airsoft. Very glad I went, I learned many things.

And thank you vermy for letting us sit inside that nice heated building rather than outside with strong cold wind.

[Bucket]

Even though i already took the AEC before, it was good for a refresher. And also to Tim, Prof and Dog you guys did a good job for being first year and all. Too bad i didnt get any CBQ :cry:

[Timmay]

It wasnt my first year of doing it. Just first year covering the safety portion.

Solo Sniper, you should post what you had, id like to read it.

[Bucket]

my bad

[Dogboy]

Timmay, and the Professor have done these in the past. It was my first AEC instruction. I hope that eveyone took something positive away from it.
Thanks to everyone that showed up. Thanks also to the parents that got you there, and waited patiently as things went longer than planned.
If you attended, and didn't learn anything, great. At least you get the certification to play.
Thanks to Rogue, and his family for the use of their facilities!

[Klootzak]

Hey guys. Thank you very much for the AEC. This was my first time hanging out with yea guys and girl's. I found it was a really cool thing. I never really though about the hole sound from loose items so thats one thing i really took away. Thanks Also a big thanks goes out to Dogboy, Dog your gun was really cool dude now i have a good idea where to look at when looking at a gun. Also thanks to everyone else that was all to friendly and nice. I must say i didnt no if i was going to like it but it turned out to be a great time so hey im looking forward to seeing all you on the field. Later

[Guerilla Dan]

Nice to know you had a good time, Klootzak.

[Professor]

Yeah, big thanks to all the attendees...good job everyone. Nearly everyone had a hard time with the marksmanship parts as a result of the wind and some with .20s so don't feel bad in anyway if you didn't hit as many as you'd have liked...every challenge is an opportunity to learn. BTW, you didn't see me trying to hit those targets :o glad I was just instructing :)

Thank you very much to Rogue, NS and all of TFD for the use of the facilities.

And, many thanks to Timmay and DogBoy for their parts in the intsructor activities.


BTW, as we are trying to provide the AEC more frequently at more locations we are in need of instructors. You will need to be a WAA member and shall need to attend and audit a class. After that you will assist and present a section with other trained instructors. If you are interested semd me a PM.

[Timmay]

Serious applicants only.

[Roadkill]

Thanks everyone for holding and helping during the AEC. I had a great time, especially during the CQB. The only downside was when a few people "tried" to lock me in the porta potty. You guys know who you are and I showed you who was boss. "hey your gonna break the door."

lol

[Black_Kade]

Hey, it was great to see so many of you again and alot of the newcommers as well. The portions of the coarse that I was actually there for were a good refresher to.

The CQB was awesome, sorry we couldnt stay.

[Lightning Fast 09]

i had a great time even though i couldn't stay for the cqb but oh well. big thanks to Professor, Dogboy, and Timmay for being intsructors and to Rogue for hosting the AEC. really i glad i went because i learned a lot about airsoft. thanks guys.

[Timmay]

Thank you for coming. What you just said right there, makes it worth doing.

I might have come down a bit firm about the safety stuff, but thats what happens when i talk about something im passionate about. Glad you all learned valuable things.

[Professor]

Hey guys, I need to clarify something. There was a player that stayed for the CQB portion that called a Bang Rule shot on me. I accepted their call and moved out. But, later I told them to just shoot me in that circumstance. By the way, I fully commend that person for having done so as they had been taught doing so in the AEC course content.

I may be entirely wrong here, but I feel that if you are going to play CQB, then you are accepting the fact that most every kill may be within the 10 foot rule and that you expect the opponents and yourself to shoot within that range as a very strong possibility. Hopefully, each contestant will make every attempt to make the shot low and not about the face as best as possible.

My opinion may be entirely wrong and I will stand corrected, but I felt that in the circumstance that the person should have just taken the shot as they may have not gotten the shot off in the time frame to have survived.

In any case, well done to that individual and I felt an explanation was in order.

[Bourne]

Thanks to Dogboy, Professor, Rogue, Night Stalker, and Tim for schedueling, and teaching the AEC, as well as putting up with a lot of ungrateful morks before and after. Thanks also to everyone who helped out with the CQB. I didn't really do a whole lot admittedly.

[Dogboy]

I'd have to agree with you Professor. The 10' rule goes out the window with CQB. Just so everyone realizes that entering a structure out on the fields does not mean it is CQB.
If you enter a building, or sturcture at the WGR, you are not "entering" into a CQB scenario. In these cases the 10' rule is in full effect, and there is no reason you should even have your finger inside the trigger guard. Too many people have, and can get hurt because someone scared the crap out of you/them coming around a corner, and get shot from point blank.
Ask anyone that has had this happen. I'm sure they will tell you it didn't feel good.

[crimtonic]

yes, thanks a bunch for hosting the AEC both me and my friend apriecated it.

[Maple]

Big thanks to Rogue for giving up the garage for the day, and to the instructors for "dropping some knowledge" about airsoft.
Also, hope that everybody that stuck around for CQB had a good time.
Please feel free to post concerns/ criticisms about the day, as the AEC staff needs not only thanks, but I'm sure they'd like to hear about what could be done better too.
Even if you and your friends had a bad time because you were bored and had to "breath second hand smoke all day", let them know. They'll work on making it better next time.
Thanks again.
-maple aka the guy who smoked all damned day and doesn't feel bad about it

[Rogue]

Just a quick post. Night Stalker and I were working in the garage again today and we are still cleaning up peoples garbage.

After hearing the comments made about the smoking and talking during the AEC, I was not happy. I mentioned that once the AEC starts, to go outside and smoke. The AEC instructors could have mentioned this further. As far as the talking, there wasn't much talking during the instruction, and if there was, it was a whisper here and there. Nobody really spoke up until everyone was going outside to do the target shooting and a little bit during the test. But it sure as hell beats sitting in a cold driveway for the AEC. (You would have thought.)

I am not too crazy about having another AEC held there since everyone bugged out without helping to take down the walls or clean up. The only ones that stayed to do it were our guys from Delta. I thought it was understood that if people wanted to do the CQB, they would have to all help to assemble it and take it down too. As far as the trash, we are not your mommies and daddies that normally follow you around during the course of your day. We shouldn't have to clean up your...

Empty BB bags, empty cans of gas, McDonalds wrappers & bags, Gatorade, bottles, plastic Coke bottles, empty cans, empty sandwich containers, and Taco Bell wrappers & bags.

This is a sample of what was cleaned up today that people left there. Is this the way you guys leave every field you play at? Or was this a case of, I donated money so I can be a slob.

This is going out to everybody who attended, it doesn't matter who you are, or what team you are on.

[Night Stalker]

:(:(:(

[Dogboy]

:(:(:(

I'll second that! Sorry to hear that things turned out that way.